TED (EDWARD BARRY) BUGLER, AT ST FRANCIS FARM IN HOOKE, TALKING TO ALASTAIR WHEELER ON 10TH NOVEMBER, 2021 ABOUT CHANGES HE HAS SEEN IN TOLLER POCORUM AND HOOKE
MR. BUGLER WAS BORN ON 29TH JUNE, 1949
TRANSCRIBED BY SALLY WAKEFIELD NOVEMBER, 2021
AW I’m Alastair Wheeler and I’m talking here, in Hooke, with Ted Bugler. So Ted, where exactly is it because I had some difficulty finding it. Where are we at the moment?
TB We are at St. Frances Farm which is in Higher Street Lane, in Hooke.
AW And how long have you been here in this place?
TB I’ve been in this place for 6 years but I’ve only moved not much more than a hundred yards down the road to here. So I’ve lived in Hooke since ’93.
AW OK.
TB Before that I lived in the valley but at Toller Pocorum.
AW And Toller Pocorum is the next village along the valley about a mile away?
TB Yes, about a mile or so.
AW Was that where you were born and brought up?
TB No, I was born near Dorchester. I moved to Toller Pocorum in 1971 when I married and we lived in a house that was in front of what was the old sawmills in Toller Pocorum.
AW Where were they?
TB They were in the High Street on the other side of the railway bridge going slightly up the hill. They used to……. originally they made coffins and all sorts of furniture and things for the village but latterly they made crates and seed trays. Things of that sort.
AW So was that a family owned business?
TB It was. It was owned by I.V. Galpin. Closed in the ’70s and the house we lived in was demolished at that point and they turned it into a housing estate. But the actual saw pit is still there, it’s now the garage of the house next door. No. 30. Yes.
AW Is there any of the equipment still in there?
TB No. It was turned into………. just turned into a garage. And that’s where it used to be and gangs used to come round and cut all the timber by hand and then move on to the next sawmill and they’d spend a week or so there and then come back when they were needed.
AW So a moving gang would come and cut down the trees for the timber?
TB They wouldn’t cut the trees down, they would cut it up into planks with one man above and one man below with hand saws.
AW Wow. Hard work!
TB Very
AW So what was your sort of trade or………………..?
TB I was a builder. I eventually had my own company and I employed nearly 50 men at one time.
AW How big an area did you cover?
TB Pretty much all of Dorset and sometimes over the borders but not often.
AW How did you get started in that? Was this a family thing handed down?
TB No. No it was not. No. I sort of started with virtually nothing and then just built it up and started employing one or two and it grew.
[00:04:01]
AW Did you start the building work before you moved to Toller or……………..?
TB Yes. I was in the building then. Yes.
AW So what sort of building work did you do?
TB All sorts. All sorts of general building. We specialised in heritage work, churches and that sort of thing. But we also did small developments occasionally. Not that often.
AW And every aspect of building?
TB Yes.
AW So you must have seen quite a lot of change over your career as to how buildings happen.
TB Yes. Very much so. It was – I was glad to finish latterly really because I was stuck doing risk assessments and what have you which wasn’t very interesting to me particularly.
AW So what sort of changes in the nature of the buildings which you were working on did you see during your time? Because that’s a 50 year period, it’s quite crucial.
TB Yes. Originally there were a lot of horrible flat roof extensions we used to do numerous amount, of which were basically grant assisted from local authorities so the people didn’t actually pay very much to improve their properties. It was like bolting on a bathroom or a kitchen on to the back of houses.
AW What sort of date was that?
TB 70s really. And then I think the grants started to run out and so that work sort of finished and we moved on to other things really. Yes, I mean the style of housing hasn’t changed much over the years around here.
AW What is the housing around here like? People listening to this may be living in America…………………..
TB Yes. Generally it’s……… they’re stone built or brick built, but not many brick built houses in this area, they are generally stone that was just quarried locally and houses built of it. But many of the quarries are now disused and closed so it used to be quite difficult to build extensions where the listed building people wanted ‘like for like’ and you couldn’t source it very easily.
AW So the listed building people wanted the same stone from the same quarry which was long since shut?
TB Exactly. There’s a lot of changes in insulation and things like that in building but the basic style of building is very similar as to what it’s always been. You get the odd modern house but not many in this area.
AW So mainly traditional housing in this area. Has that got a history back……………… some of the buildings round here presumably go back several centuries?
TB Yes, they do. There are some very old buildings. As I said we used to do an awful lot of work for churches and heritage stuff which was very enjoyable – taking apart old buildings and seeing how they were put together and how they were improved over the years.
AW You could see the skill of the earlier workmen?
TB Yes, Absolutely. I mean the listed building people now you know absolutely decry UPVC windows but, in my view, taking apart old buildings, the best materials were used at the time they were improved upon. And if that be UPVC windows, they only have a particular life span so I don’t think you particularly spoil a building by using modern materials. Providing they’re not there permanently.
AW So what was the scope of the ancient building work for churches and other stuff you did? Obviously there’s just a couple of little chuches here locally so you must have travelled far and wide ?
TB Yes, we did some work at Milton Abbey. Did some roof work there. Generally speaking most of it was maintenance, cutting out stone that had weathered too badly, lead work on roofs, all sorts of stuff and putting in ramps, of course, for disabled use latterly.
AW So the requirement to make buildings accessible meant that you had to put in access ramps to get wheelchairs and things up? Did that mean a lot of work for you. Was that something that was quite common?
TB It was quite common. Yes, we did a number of them. Generally speaking, the church was sort of maintenance but it kept three or four men going permanently. It was quite a good thing to have.
AW This little area, the Hooke/Toller area……. I’m new to this. Like many people I retired here five years ago, you’ve obviously lived here a long time, have you see a lot of people moving in, retired, have you seen a lot of change in the population?
TB Yes, an awful lot of change in the population. Luckily there are not too many second homes here; there are probably three or four, but not more than that. We’ve got barns and things that have been converted to holiday accommodation.
AW Many of those?
TB There are quite a few but not huge amounts. We don’t get overwhelmed although, at times, opposite here that is turned into holiday accommodation …………..
AW What’s that opposite here?
TB It’s a Field Study Centre. But during the holidays…………..
AW What’s it called?
TB It’s called Hooke Court.
AW Hooke Court Field Study Centre. Was that an old building?
TB It is an old building, yes, with quite a number of modern extensions, etc. in the grounds. That’s quite nice, it provides some nice local employment for people which is really needed.
AW So there isn’t much other employment in this area?
TB Not a great deal, no. Other than agriculture really There’s a fish farm here but other than that there’s really not a great deal of industry.
AW What sort of fish do they grow here?
TB Just the trout. They’ve got a trout farm which has got an excellent reputation. I mean they can actually restock rivers because they are disease free which most of them aren’t these days.
AW So trout from Hooke go all over the place?
TB They do indeed.
AW What other occupation is there these days? Because when you were younger presumably there were more people working on farms, more people working locally like in the sawmills.
TB Yes, everybody had a few employees on farms but there’s a very big farm behind us now which is Hollis Mead which do all the local milk – they don’t sell to any big company – they put them through vending machines which they’ve got a good number of now……
AW So Hollis Mead Farm using a different way of selling their milk through vending machines.
TB Yes, absolutely. And that’s all they do. And they make butter and cheese and……………. once again it’s employment. So they employ a few people, they go as far afield as Exeter now with the milk.
AW How far is Exeter from here?
TB About 50 miles.
AW Some distance. But not so many people working?
TB No, I guess not on the land. I mean they have dairy people and things like that, and cheese makers and delivery people but possibly not as many on the land certainly as there used to be. I can remember when I lived in Toller talking to an old farmer there, a chap called Peter Billen, who used to, as a 14 year old boy, he said he used to sit on the horses and ride them to Hooke and there was a Farrier in Hooke and he used to ride them up and they would be shod. And then he would ride them back and that was how, basically, I found out that………… he’d always told me that there was ………………. his father and grandfather when they came past the Old Swan pub in Toller Pocorum the wheels of the cart would make a different noise going along Kingcombe Road. They always thought there was something underneath the road. And he said he always felt it when he would ride the horses across there. It would just make like a hollow sound.
[00:14:34]
A few years later when we came to renovate what was the original vicarage in Toller Pocorum which was quite a low building that goes along Kingcombe Road – right opposite the Swan – we discovered a smugglers’ tunnel there. It led from there under the road and there used to be, before the skittle alley was built there, there used to be an outbuilding in the car park that was used basically as a games room, and I think there was a pool table or something in there. But that was quite clearly where it led and I did get down in there and have a look. It had partially filled in under the road but quite clearly ………………
AW How big a tunnel was it then?
TB It was probably about 1 metre , probably a little bit higher than that, maybe 1.5 high. You’d certainly, you’d crouch but you’d get through there easily enough.
AW OK for rolling barrels through or whatever.
TB Yes. I mean the chap we did it for at the time wouldn’t allow us to take any pictures and he wouldn’t allow us to call in the archaeologists or anything to have a look which was a great shame. We just had to finish the floor and ……… it’s still there I know.
AW So the tunnel is still there under the road?
TB The tunnel is still there and I know pretty much exactly where it is.
AW And it went from the old rectory?
TB Yes.
AW Was that from, do you think, before it was a rectory?
TB No apparently it was the original rectory. I mean it’s not a big building, it’s a long building that had stables and a coach house at one end but it is a very low-slung building. It probably had bedrooms in it but they would have been sort of under the roof. I guess original vicarages probably weren’t that grand.
AW So they had a direct connection under the road to the pub?
TB They did indeed.
AW I like it!
TB I guess they were often involved in smuggling weren’t they?
AW So smuggling around here was obviously quite a fact of life at one stage?
TB I guess it was, they all had their routes inland didn’t they. They would have had to I guess to shift the goods but yes, it was very interesting.
AW What other interesting buildings have you had the chance to work on?
TB We did the old Dorset Long House in Kingcombe. In Lower Kingcombe. And we discovered there a nice old winding stone staircase alongside the Inglenook fireplace as they used to be that had all been blocked up. That was very nice restoring all that and doing the roof and everything. It all had to be completely gutted but it was all put back very sympathetically. Still there.
AW How old was the roof that you were replacing?
TB Probably about 1700 I would think. Something like that. There’s quite a depth of thatch on these old buildings and they were also hedgerow timbers so it’s very difficult to put a date on them really.
AW When you say ‘hedgerow timbers’, they were just using local wood rather than posh stuff?
TB Yes exactly. As you’d cut out from a tree. Stuff maybe 3 inches in diameter and just put together with blacksmith nails.
AW So the Farrier, down the road here, how long did they survive? Any idea?
TB I don’t, no. I don’t know how long they would have survived, probably into the 1920s but I wouldn’t have thought much more than that. The building’s still there. It’s the building that is on the end of the house that is at the bottom of Green lane and Kingcombe Road.
AW Here in Hooke?
TB Here in Hooke, yes. It’s just a single storey part that’s now I think used as a kitchen or something to the adjoining house. But the building still exists.
AW So what other changes have you seen in your life around these parts?
TB It’s very difficult to say really. Lack of road maintenance that’s for sure. (Laughter) We do get quite a lot of floods here.
AW Are the floods getting worse?
TB Probably a little bit but mainly because of the lack of drainage that used to be maintained and no longer is.
AW So the country lanes around here used to be maintained by people who no longer do it?
TB Exactly.
AW It’s all done centrally, by the Council.
TB And you know, Hooke Court was obviiously quite a grand house at one time. I think it was King George VI visited here.
AW So there’s been a Royal visitor?
TB Yes. Indeed. And the rumour is that Lily Langtree stayed down at one of the places I own further down the road.
AW While the King was in residence?
TB While the King was in residence.
AW He brought his Mistress, Lily Langtree, with him? It was that open and overt.
NOTE: Lily Langtree was the Mistress of Edward VII, not George VI
TB Of course that’s all changed now. They’ve built a big nursery in the grounds now. There’s a Nursery School there.
AW Oh, Nursery School, not a nursery for plants.
TB No a Nursery School. I did meet a chap 4 or 5 years ago who said……………… he lived over at Litton Cheney somewhere and he said ‘Oh you live in Hooke do you?’ And I said ‘Yes’. He said ‘I used to have relatives from Hooke’. And he said ‘They lived in Green Lane. Do you know the big oak tree in Green Lane by Manor Farm?’ and he said, he couldn’t remember whether it was his Great Aunt or his Great, Great Aunt who worked in the kitchens at Hooke Court who lived in the little hovel just behind where that oak tree is. And he said that the family story was that that acorn came from a pigeon she was disecting in the kitchen and she took it home and planted it beside the gate of her cottage. And he said that’s how the oak tree came to be there. Which is a lovely little story really. Of course, in those days the Court owned most of Hooke.
AW So the owners of the Court owned most of the area?
TB Yes, they did. In fact they put in…………….. by the trout farm, Hooke Springs, is a track that goes up that comes out on top of the hill that is a footpath and bridle path but apparently that was put in by the owners of Hooke Court so that they didn’t have to go through the village and mix with the ‘riffraff’ .
AW So that was their private way out?
TB That was their own private way out.
AW Heading for Dorchester presumably?
TB Presumably.
AW Maiden Newton and Dorchester.
TB I mean most of these big houses had several routes in and out didn’t they ?
AW Do you know who the family who lived in the big house were?
TB I think it was the Sandwiches I think that probably owned most of it but there’s been various owners over the years. They did a Time Team dig over there, must be 15 years ago.
AW Time Team is the television archaeology programme isn’t it?
TB Yes. They didn’t find a great deal but they did find some Civil War things there so there was obviiously a bit of a skirmish here I guess..
[00:23:35]
AW I wonder where the things they found ended up because we’d be quite interested in knowing about that for the museum.
TB They may, they’ve got quite a lot of information over there, it might be worth contacting them.
AW At the Court itself?
TB I think, yes. Whether they kept any of the artefacts or whether they are with the museum I really don’t know.
AW I suspect as Time Team were professional archaeologists they would have deposited them with Dorchester.
TB Dorchester, probably. Yes. I think they probably would.
AW So the family put in a new road for them but at the time, until recently, there was the railway that went through Toller Pocorum wasn’t there?
TB Yes, there was. I’ve actually been on it. Several times, yes. A number of times.
AW It wasn’t exactly high speed I think?
TB No, my wife used to take my daughter shopping that way into Bridport because we lived, at that time, right behind….. I could touch the Halt roof. I built a bungalow there and I could touch the Halt roof. But I mean the stories I used to hear in the Old Swan was that the train used to come through Maiden Newton, from Maiden Newton, of an evening and every time it passed the Swan the driver got out, went into the Swan and the landlord had a pint ready for him and he’d drink it and go on to Bridport. And then stop on the way back for another. (Laughter)
AW Do you believe the stories?
TB Yes I do. I don’t suppose there was any great rush to get to Bridport and probably not many people to bring back in the evenings.
AW So when you say train , it was probably just an engine and a carriage?
TB Engine and a carriage, yes, that’s all it used to be. They dismantled the Halt while I was living there and it went down on to the Totnes line.
AW So the station that was in Toller Pocorum is now down …………………..
TB Yes, it either went to Totnes or on that line somewhere.
AW South Devon Railway.
TB Yes. So at least it wasn’t just demolished and got rid of.
AW Yes, so that bit of Toller Pocorum history continues.
TB As far as I know. I mean I think the platform and everything is still there.
AW I believe it is yes. So going shopping. Was that something that a lot of villagers would use the train for?
TB Yes, it was. Originally Hooke was very famous for its watercress.
AW Watercress?
TB I mean there’s………….. back in the hill here only 50 yards or so the other side odf the river there’s still a lot of watercress beds and where the fish farm is that was all watercress beds. And that used to be taken to Toller and go off to Maiden Newton and then off to Dorchester and then off to London. It was quite a big business.
AW The train was key to that bit of business?
TB It was. Absolutely. Again I don’t know how long ago it finished but you know if was quite a big business. There was quite a number of, I mean there was probably at least half a dozen big watercress beds here, or were. Some of them, I mean I can still go up and pick a handful of cress occasionally when I feel like it.
AW It’s still got some of the watercress in there?
TB Still there, yes. And it’s really nice. It’s a really nice spicy watercress, not like the stuff you tend to buy these days which tastes of watercress but doesn’t have that peppery bite to it.
AW So the railway was quite crucial to transport in this area because it’s a very hilly area isn’t it?
TB I mean, people didn’t have two cars then. I used to go off to work and my wife was stuck and that was her means of getting to Bridport.
AW So Bridport was where people went for their shopping?
TB Yes it was. I mean I guess some people would go to Dorchester on the odd occasion but probably not often really. It was more difficult I guess to get to Dorchester. You could get the train to Maiden Newton and go on but…………
AW So there weren’t any buses around here then?
TB I’m trying to think if there was a bus at that time. I think there probably would have been but I honestly can’t recall whether there was or not. In those days there was a Post Office and shop and everything in toller and there was even a little one in Hooke but ……….
AW A little Post Office in Hooke?
TB Yes there was. And it was where the old forge was, in that building.
AW Was that just owned by somebody or was it attached to some other………………….
TB No, it was just owned by somebody. Long since gone but they’ve all gone now haven’t they? All the……….
AW What did the Post Office in Hooke sell? Was it just stamps or did they sell bread, milk, eggs, whatever?
TB Yes, probably more sweets and things like that than anything I guess. But little bits and pieces.
AW That was another way in which people could get some supplies?
TB They could. There was always milk. I mean until I moved to Hooke in ’93 I mean we were still buying milk from the farm. I had a milk can that I’d just call in on my way home from work and dip out some unpasteurised milk and pay the farmer for it.
AW Being unpasteurised the milk wouldn’t last long then?
TB No, it was OK. It would………. it was a couple of pints so it would last as long as you probably needed it to.
AW And Toller Pocorum shops then. You said there was a bigger Post Office there?
TB Yes there was. There’s still a Post Office there now. There’s still one that exists there now. Little sort of Community Post Office and shop that they run.
AW So the Community shops are almost coming back into sort of fashion aren’t they these days?
TB I guess so, yes. And there’s probably, at least in the summer, there are a lot more people around these days to use them. I mean if you go to Cornwall or somewhere like that they’re everywhere because they get a lot more holidaymakers than we do but we get our fair share now really.
AW So in the summer the population does grow with visitors?
TB It does, yes. With the holiday accommodation in Hooke this year, I mean, it can almost double the population.
AW So what sort of numbers are you talking about?
TB Best part of a…….probably, 100 people I would think.
AW Extra?
TB Extra.
AW And they’d presumably, you were saying that not many of them are second homes, so they’ll be here for a week and then go and then somebody else turns up.
TB Yes, there’s various B & Bs and sort of lodges and things like that they stay in and Hooke Court gets converted over to holiday accommodation during the summer holidays.
AW So people come on holiday to Hooke Court in the summer.
TB This year, because of the pandemic and that, they’ve made more of it so that there’s quite a lot more people staying. They’ve converted a bit more over to it.
AW So the pandemic is this Coronavirus that has been affecting the whole country for the last almost getting on for 2 years now. As we’re talking here today. So that has had an effect on the locality.
TB Very much yes.
AW More people staying on holiday here that would historically gone overseas?
TB Yes, absolutely, and I mean the main business, Hooke Court as a Field Study Centre, they had nobody and its picked up quite recently.
AW What’s a Field Study Centre?
TB Well, they bus in sort of a couple of hundred children at a time who do various studies here. I mean they make rockets, they build dens in the woods, they learn about …………….. they’ve got a First World War trench so that they learn about how the old trench warfare went and how many people lost their lives. They do a lot of good educational stuff here and ………………. but that is their income and to lose all that was a real big blow. They struggled obviously.
AW So during the Coronavirus people couldn’t travel and there was even lockdown for a while wasn ‘t there?
TB Yes, there was. Made life quite difficult.
AW Did that impact you?
TB No, not really because I mean although we’d got a lockdown I’ve got 9 acres here and lots of different animals so it’s, it was quite, I don’t mind being at home really so. I suppose the social side disappeared for a bit but other than that we’ve got plenty of freedom to walk round here so………….
AW so the animals you keep here. Was that something you got in to by way of a hobby, or………………….?
TB Yes. It’s not a money making exercise. We’ve got goats, miniature donkeys, pony, sheep, 3 barn cats, dog, chickens so we’ve got quite a menagerie here.
AW Are there any kids? Young people in the community these days?
TB Yes, there are. We’ve got quite a number of young children here. Not enough to run a school but there’s certainly a fair share of young people here.
AW So when you were in Toller, was there a village school in the area then?
TB There was a village school in Toller then. My daughter went to the local village school for probably 3 or 4 years before it shut.
AW When did it shut then?
TB That would have shut probably in ’74, ’75, I guess. And then they built the new school at Maiden Newton.
AW So from here the kids have to travel to Maiden?
TB Yes they do/
AW How far’s that?
TB It’s about 6 miles I think.
AW By bus? Or do parents have to take them?
TB No, there’s a bus. And then from there they go into Beaminster when they reach the appropriate age.
AW So for secondary schooling it’s Beaminster in the opposite direction really?
TB Yes it is. I was a school governor when it first opened, Maiden Newton, for a number of years.
AW What did that involve, being school governor?
TB In those days not as much as it does now.
AW So how far back are you talking when you say ‘those days’?
TB Well back to the early ’70s.
AW Early 70s, governor of the new school in Maiden Newton.
TB Basically you’d sit in on interviews for staff, you’d help out if there was something wanted decorating, generally we were roped in but …………………..
AW Especially given your trade and your abilities you’d be a popular chap.
TB But I mean, I think these days, it’s a bit more involved. There’s a lot of paperwork that you have to be signed up to and do.
AW How many kids were there at the school in the ’70s roughly.
TB Probably, there was about 80 children I think. Maiden Newton was quite big and there’s quite a few little settlements just around the area.
[00:36:54]
AW And that was just primary school age?
TB Yes I think Toller had something close to 20 children you know so there were a few that went from there. And then the pub shut there, and then the Post Office shut there.
AW So the station shut. The pub shut………
TB The station shut and everything shut down really.
AW So that must have been a period which was quite depressing to live through was it? Everything seemed to be shutting down.
TB Yes. Everything seemed to shut yes.
AW That would be what, the ’80s, 1980s.
TB Yes. The pub shut first and then the Post Office shut not really very long after.
AW Was the pub privately owned or was it the brewery that shut it?
TB No it was the brewery, Palmers. There was a full scale Public Enquiry. A two day Public Enquiry with barristers from London and everything, in the village hall.
AW About whether the pub should stay open?
TB Whether the pub should stay open or not and it was found that the pub could be viable and they wouldn’t grant Palmers permission to close it and sell it as a house. But they waited 5 years and then reapplied and got what they wanted so a Public Enquiry that cost a small fortune counted for very little at the end of the day.
AW Lasted 5 years.
TB Yes, which was a shame. But there you are. I think pubs are all about who runs them rather than where they are.
AW They can be. And the personality of the publicans. So was it some people that were there for a long time running it until it closed or did it keep changing?
TB Yes. There was a landlord there who had been there since the ’70s, early ’70s and he was I think Palmers longest serving landlord. And then he got to an age where he felt he needed to retire and he retired and then there were, I think there were 2 more landlords after that who obviously didn’t make it work and then it shut.
AW Then they shut it despite the Enquiry.
TB Yes, and then for a while they ran a little bar in the village hall there but I don’t think that worked.
AW So there’s a village hall in Toller?
TB Yes, I built it.
AW You built it? When was that then?
TB That must have been early ’80s I would have thought. Something like that. Probably ’85, somewhere around about there.
AW So, village halls can be all sorts of sizes and designs. How big and what was it made of?
TB There used to be just a galvanised iron-clad hall and it was getting very dilapidated. It was freezing cold in the winter and couldn’t really be used so the Council owned a piece of land in Toller, just near the railway bridge there, and they agreed that……………. they put some starter homes there……… but they agreed to allow a piece of land for the new village hall.
AW Round the back of the church?
TB Yes, it is. It’s quite a large village hall. For a place like Toller it’s quite big.
AW And properly built!
TB. Yes, hopefully.
AW So what do they use it for? Do you know?
TB I think it’s all sorts of things. They have short mat bowls there, I think it’s quite a busy little thing.
AW So it is an actual community focus for the area.
TB Yes. It’s a while since I’ve been to anything there but I think …………….. I’m reading in the parish magazine it’s used quite frequently.
AW So is there sort of much connection between Hooke and Toller? Or are they two separate villages. Sometimes villages can be quite independent.
TB Yes, they are quite independent really. They come together for church things sometimes. You know, fundraising things You’ll get a few people will go that way and a few people will come this way, but very much a separate entity I think really.
AW And Hooke has its own little church ?
TB It does.
AW Which is quite an old one is it?
TB No, it’s not that old. You hear of stories over the years but they said that it was not Consecrated so people used to have to be taken to Powerstock to be buried.
AW Where’s Powerstock from here?
TB It’s three and a half miles in that direction, in a southerly direction.
AW Southerly. Over the hill. So taking someone to be buried 3 1/2 miles away ………… So they went there rather than Toller Pocorum?
TB Rather than Toller. Why, I really don’t know, but that’s how I hear it. That’s what used to happen.
AW These things did happen like that, yes. So Hooke isn’t that old as a church community centre, but Toller? It’s got an older church has it?
TB It has, yes. Recently had all the lead stolen from the roof.
AW That will be a challenge to replace.
TB Yes, I think they’re still raising money now to try and do it.
AW So Toller is the bigger village with more going on historically? How does it feel now to be living in Hooke?
TB Quite nice really. I like the solitude. It’s not as busy. when I moved here I bought…………… I mean this used to be a Church of England Reform School, Hooke Court.
AW Hooke Court was?
TB It was, yes, and I bought some property down here which……………..
AW So that was after the family sold it off?
TB Yes. It was a Church of England Reform School and
AW And a Reform School was a school for kids with problems?
TB Children with problems and children with, well, more parental problems probably than children’s problems but they ended up here.
AW They ended up in Hooke in the middle of nowhere in the middle of Dorset.
TB In the middle of nowhere. And the property I bought down the road was the Sixth Form dormitories which had escape proof windows. If there’d ever been a fire in there it would have been an absolue disaster. I mean a lot of the boys would be trying to run away and so they had windows that were very tiny at the top. They would let fresh air in but wouldn’t let a boy out that’s for certain. And I bought that and converted it.
AW When was that?
TB 1993. And that was when they sold it off. I think the reason it shut was, at that time councils were getting very short of money because the children came from all over England but their various councils had to pay for them to be here. I think money was getting tight and councils were shutting back on what they could do and they were getting less and less children so they decided to shut it and sell it all off.
AW So you managed to buy that bit of…………….
TB Yes, that was sold off separately so I bought that. Which was part of the old farm and it also contained the walled garden for Hooke Court.
AW The old walled garden? Was it still there?
TB It’s still there now. it’s not ……………. I mean it did have walls…………….. someone showed me a picture once and I could never get a copy of it. Walls 7ft. 6ins. high all the way round and it had hothouses in there and apparently Hooke Court used to employ something in the region of 13 gardeners at one time which, I guess, you’d probably …………..
AW Victorian times? Although, the King’s coming to visit then they’d need lots of gardeners then.
TB Yes, lots of gardeners. You know I guess you’d have probably 2 or 3 working in the kitchen garden. Because you’d have to be completely independent vegetable wise, living out here, so it was…….. Yes, I bought that and also there was like, a farm, little farm buildings attached to it that the boys from here used to keep all sorts in. Chickens, rabbits, guinea pigs and things.
AW So they were trying to give them something to do to pass the time…………………..
TB Yes, to stop them burning all the barns down in the area because they used ………………
AW Did they do that?
TB They did, yes. (Laughter) The poor farmers used to be in a ……………
AW So the farmers in the area weren’t all that keen on having an Approved School here?
TB I don’t think it was necessarily deliberate, they would just get in the barns and smoke, and up it would go.
AW But now you’re here enjoying the quiet of the community.
TB Absolutely.
AW OK. Well, thank you for talking about things. That was fascinating.
[00:47:19]